View Full Version : Worms Revolution at E3 2012
Co-Optimus (http://www.co-optimus.com/article/8396/e3-2012-worms-revolution-hands-on-preview.html)
Cinemablend (http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Worms-Revolution-E3-Preview-Classic-Gameplay-Gets-Even-Better-43299.html)
Theverge (http://www.theverge.com/gaming/2012/6/6/3068651/e3-worms-revolution)
Tecca.com (http://www.tecca.com/columns/e3-2012-worms-revolution-xbla-psn-steam/)
Flesheatingzipper.com (http://www.flesheatingzipper.com/gaming/2012/06/e3-2012-worms-revolution-hands-on/)
Computerandvideogames.com (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/348351/worms-revolution-gets-water-physics-screens/)
From all the things i've read, Worms revolutions has had a pretty universal positive standing with anyone that went to T17s booth.. Just like to say Congrats to T17 and continue on with the amazing work.
Saw no reason why not to post this here as well.
The class based system appears interesting i must admit, any word on when this year the game might be released?
The vids, much more interesting :p
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRKnDaXse0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnEq8AmtuKk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrW3U1us9jk
@xtreem, end of september'ish, see 2nd vid ;)
Gah, would you look at that beach theme - the graphics are just so stunning D: I want that game now!
Scrubber
10 Jun 2012, 20:41
Not too long to wait then. Can't wait for this.
Turbo-T
10 Jun 2012, 21:10
15 Dollars is really cheap, but were is the announcement of the PS Vita Worms Revolution :(
I´m a mobile gamer and want to kick your asses on my couch or my garden, everywere...
Extremist2
11 Jun 2012, 00:43
15 dollars sounds like a good deal.
MrPanic
10 Jul 2012, 17:16
The vids, much more interesting :p
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRKnDaXse0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnEq8AmtuKk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrW3U1us9jk
@xtreem, end of september'ish, see 2nd vid ;)
I like how the second video shows that the replay feature was still totally broken at E3. It's tricky to program a decent replay feature when dynamic features like water are involved in gameplay. Old Worms game are really strict in gameplay, if a grenade is thrown in the exact same way twice, the exact same thing is going to happen, the replay only needs to track the user input. The whole certainty is thrown out the window when a dynamic element is thrown in, so they can throw the old replay system out of the window as well. A lot of ways to fix it though, but probably has some compromises to make it work on all platforms since tracking dynamic elements can be really heavy. My guess is they gonna track all the worm and weapon movement and leave the dynamic elements dynamic, causing that not all but most replays are accurate, but worm movement will always be right so situations like the second vid won't happen.
No, it's not that hard. On paper there's no reason it couldn't work (the only obstacle being that all water positions/velocities would have to be saved once a turn), the replay failure seems like just another bug. Quite simply, the only reason that replay failed was because either the worms' actions weren't copied exactly right, or they didn't use the same random numbers that the actual turn had.
I hope there's more themes than what they're showing, I'm tired of beach and sewer now
Also pre-made landscape themes are sexy ;)
MrPanic
12 Jul 2012, 06:06
No, it's not that hard. On paper there's no reason it couldn't work (the only obstacle being that all water positions/velocities would have to be saved once a turn), the replay failure seems like just another bug. Quite simply, the only reason that replay failed was because either the worms' actions weren't copied exactly right, or they didn't use the same random numbers that the actual turn had.
I think you are really underestimating the impact of a dynamic element. If their water really is a dynamic element like they say it is, random numbers won't have anything to do with it, I can assure you.
I think you are really underestimating the impact of a dynamic element. If their water really is a dynamic element like they say it is, random numbers won't have anything to do with it, I can assure you.
Right. Unless you're trying to say "It's so dynamic, it moves with the wind blowing around your computer, and expands as your computer heats up", I have no idea what you're talking about.
MrPanic
13 Jul 2012, 19:36
A true dynamic element is unpredictable in movement, it can hit the same spot five times and react to it differently five times. It's not determined by preset numbers that simulate randomness like Worms games usually do but by a truly dynamic process determined by the physics and moment. It really differs from how they used to handle a replay camera, you'll suddenly have to track every dynamic element in a way it still function with the normal game, something no gamedeveloper would even attempt if he's right in his mind, you'll have to program around that by tracking the worms and weapons instead(or make sure that the water isn't dynamic, but that would defeat its purpose in the first place).
It really differs from game to game as well. An example that comes to mind is SSX. SSX3 had a replay feature, the game had avalanches but those weren't truly dynamic. SSX 2012 however featured dynamic avalanches, one of the key reasons why it didn't have a replay feature, the rider might take same path in the replay, but the avalanches produced by it can be different everytime because of the many factors that can alter it's path, making a replay feature that would track that would take so much resources and time that they opted against a replay feature in the end. Team 17 is basically being faced with the same problem, although on a much smaller degree since it only involves the water. Basically there are two options, either the water isn't as dynamic as it seems, or they need to make a replay system that doesn't resemble any of the old Worms replay system since those only involve tracking input and preset values and don't take anything dynamic into account.
Ok, that was more than I wanted to type, I hope it's clear what I'm trying to say.
Plutonic
15 Jul 2012, 12:51
A true dynamic element is unpredictable in movement, it can hit the same spot five times and react to it differently five times. It's not determined by preset numbers that simulate randomness like Worms games usually do but by a truly dynamic process determined by the physics and moment. It really differs from how they used to handle a replay camera, you'll suddenly have to track every dynamic element in a way it still function with the normal game, something no gamedeveloper would even attempt if he's right in his mind, you'll have to program around that by tracking the worms and weapons instead(or make sure that the water isn't dynamic, but that would defeat its purpose in the first place).
It really differs from game to game as well. An example that comes to mind is SSX. SSX3 had a replay feature, the game had avalanches but those weren't truly dynamic. SSX 2012 however featured dynamic avalanches, one of the key reasons why it didn't have a replay feature, the rider might take same path in the replay, but the avalanches produced by it can be different everytime because of the many factors that can alter it's path, making a replay feature that would track that would take so much resources and time that they opted against a replay feature in the end. Team 17 is basically being faced with the same problem, although on a much smaller degree since it only involves the water. Basically there are two options, either the water isn't as dynamic as it seems, or they need to make a replay system that doesn't resemble any of the old Worms replay system since those only involve tracking input and preset values and don't take anything dynamic into account.
Ok, that was more than I wanted to type, I hope it's clear what I'm trying to say.
I think your both confusing the concept of dynamic with deterministic. You can have a system that is both dynamic and deterministic.
As long as the physics time step is locked, and it's calculations are done in fixed point. It should be perfectly possible to reset the system to a know point and re-play it. If however it is using floating point or the time step isn't fixed then rounding errors will inherently cause the behaviour to differ ever so slightly.
At which point the problem becomes much more difficult, or impossible to solve. But it has nothing to do with being dynamic. The weapons in WA were dynamic and they worked fine in replays.
d3rd3vil
15 Jul 2012, 17:59
The fact of the matter is, Worms Revolution looks great. Reloaded also looked good though and is not as good as Worms Armageddon.
It's not about the graphics. It's about the gameplay, for example the rope, how good can you control it? And it's about the lags and sync probs that Reloaded had. It was just not as fluently as Armageddon. Even though Reloaded is newer and more modern and should have done it better :(
And then there is the main chat in Armageddon. It's everything. There was nothing like that in Reloaded and there were not many players online EVER!
So why would all that change with Revolution? I am sure it will come out for PC, PS3, Xbox 360 and and and....therefor it won't be that different. And I strongly doubt there will be a main chat on the PS3 or 360 version nor an amazing gameplay like in Worms Armageddon.
Good old times when games where just made for the PC :(
this is a wonderfull surprise!! truly!!!! but on a typical winging forum tip the guy above me is right.........if this doesnt play like wa2 then i wont be playing it for long no matter how next gen it looks.........i wonder if we can get a guarantee team 17 that youll have the multiplayer working properly with this one? i guess this explains why the other never got fixed and probs means it never will now :o
on a positive this is ****ing brilliant news seeing as i only dropped by first time in months cos i wanted to start a 4 player w2a and we all couldnt f'ing get in!
im praying this is so good i wont give a **** about w2a but come on how can you beat perfection............IM PRAYING!!! :eek:
:) in the pro ranked lobby........now i must leave again gotta go hand out flyers for worms revolution release :D
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