IE 7 should be burnt, blown up and then thrown into the sun

[thomasp]

Has IE7 been updated recently?

It seems to have suddenly broken my dad's website and I could swear it worked fine when IE7 was first released. And I haven't changed anything either!

When will Microsoft start accepting the W3C guidelines for rendering pages?? It works fine on Firefox (Mac & PC), Safari, Camino, IE6... just not IE7 :mad:


Anyway, that's my rant for tonight.


Oh and it doesn't work properly in Opera, but it still works better than in IE7. But that might just be because Opera seems to be allergic to GIFs...

[M3ntal]

It may be that you tried some of the newer CSS 2/3 while styling it, it did nothing in FF/Op because it isn't supported by those yet, so you just left the style in there and forgot about it. IE7 supports a lot of newer CSS than the others, so it may be using this style that you think is doing nothing, and that's the problem.

That's about all i can think of; generally if it works in FF and IE6, it means its near enough W3C compliant and IE bugs have been worked around as well, so it should definately work in IE7.

[thomasp]

I didn't actually code the site - my dad paid quite a bit of money (*cough*£1k*cough*) back in early 2006, and looking at the CSS code, it looks like it might be of a newer form than I'm used to.

I've noticed Opera does throw up a load of CSS errors and won't display the pages correctly, so there's definitely something up with the CSS.

[SupSuper]

You can always try viewing iit n the latest Opera alpha (http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blog/), if that fixes the problem then it's very likely the CSS.

I don't think Microsoft does any updates to IE7's rendering functionality, they're preoccupied with IE8 already.

[Star Worms]

Unfortunately, Microsoft didn't appear to add any more CSS functions to IE7 than were already in IE6.

I'm not joking when I say it took me about the same amount of time to get the site to function in IE as it did to actually make the entire site itself.

You just have to persevere and try and work around it. I'm a bit rusty but you could post the CSS up and give us a screenshot of the good vs the bad/ugly.

Also, after finding out IE7 had no extra CSS capabilities, I removed IE7 altogether. The blurred multicolour text is just as cringe-worthy. And the tabs the size of concord were not pretty to look at either.

[FutureWorm]

http://www.gelatinous.net/ has like the simplest css ever but ie somehow still manages to break it

[thomasp]

Well, our website designer has fixed it, and apparently it seems to be a common issue - IE7 breaking websites.

[Star Worms]

Indeed it is. From experience, I know you have to go to a lot of trouble to make even simple things work. First of all you have to find out what it can't handle. Then you have to alter it into language it can understand. Absolute pain in the **** and I was gobsmacked when I realised Microsoft hadn't added these key features that all other popular browsers support.

[SupSuper]

To prevent new versions from breaking old sites, Microsoft is planning to have sites target specific browser versions so that new versions never affect them. No, I'm not kidding. (http://alistapart.com/articles/beyonddoctype)

[thomasp]

Wouldn't it just be easier and simpler to code IE so it conforms to the same standards that all the other browsers do?

[AndrewTaylor]

Wouldn't it just be easier and simpler to code IE so it conforms to the same standards that all the other browsers do?

That would be simpler and easier for the end user, though, an idea which is anathema to Microsoft.

[M3ntal]

Unfortunately, Microsoft didn't appear to add any more CSS functions to IE7 than were already in IE6.


Also, after finding out IE7 had no extra CSS capabilities...
What? Only half an hour ago, i was using input[type=checkbox] {...}. There are loads.

[SupSuper]

It's better but still far from perfect (http://www.gtalbot.org/BrowserBugsSection/MSIE7Bugs/).

Either way, IE8 will still have a new engine that sticks to the standards (or so they claim). But to prevent breaking any current sites that no doubt will go bat**** insane as always happens with every update (regardless of IE7-hacks or no IE7-hacks), it'll use the old IE7 engine by default (so that developers can update in their own schedule or just not update at all and still live happily, they claim). So besides the old standards and quirks modes, you'll also have new mode.

In short, if you do nothing at all, nothing at all changes with IE8. You'll have to specifically target your website to IE8 (with <meta>) for it to use the new mode.

[AndrewTaylor]

That's still a good thing, I think, if it works that way. It means that people won't have to choose between working in IE and standards compliant.

[Star Worms]

What? Only half an hour ago, i was using input[type=checkbox] {...}. There are loads.Everything after plain CSS has never worked for me on IE7, even though CSS2 has been around for ages. I have never seen any difference between IE6 and IE7 and how they load the page. For me, they have always been equally incorrect. Maybe they have added updates to fix things.

[thomasp]

It's better but still far from perfect (http://www.gtalbot.org/BrowserBugsSection/MSIE7Bugs/).

*Screams*

Either way, IE8 will still have a new engine that sticks to the standards (or so they claim).

I'll believe that when I see it... :p

[AndrewTaylor]

So basically, what you're saying is that IE7 should be burned three times at different speeds?

[thomasp]

Ideally, yes.

And at three different temperatures.

[Xinos]

I can burn it at three different speeds if you really want me too, but you'll have to pay for the discs.

[SupSuper]

The conversion would probably cost more than the discs.

[M3ntal]

Everything after plain CSS has never worked for me on IE7, even though CSS2 has been around for ages. I have never seen any difference between IE6 and IE7 and how they load the page. For me, they have always been equally incorrect. Maybe they have added updates to fix things.
Try having a play with max-height, min-height, max-width, min-width, position: fixed, selectors like element:first-child and element[attribute="value"], they are all CSS 2.1.

Yes, it's still a pigs-ear of a browser, but it'd be incorrect to say it has no more CSS support than IE6